There’s been a lot of talk about the potential for a historic win for Democrats this midterm season in Texas, given that no Democrat has held statewide office in the Lone Star State in over 30 years.
But Gov. Greg Abbott also stands on the precipice of a historic victory: If he wins re-election, he is poised to become the longest-serving governor in the state during this upcoming term.
Currently, that title is held by Rick Perry, who held the office between 2000 and 2015.
So what does it mean for someone to lead Texas for that long? How does the strategy of governance change over that time?
Deirdre Delisi, a government relations consultant and the former chief of staff and advisor to Perry, stopped by Texas Standard to answer that question.
This transcript has been edited lightly for clarity:
Texas Standard: I’m curious to hear your thoughts on what shifts for a governor once they’ve been in office for more than a decade. What would you say the biggest changes are between a first-term governor and a fourth-term governor?
Deirdre Delisi: I think when you’re in your first term as a governor, you’re just getting used to a new role. You are getting used to running a giant network of state agencies, and those people and those agencies are getting to know you. You’re doing that at the same time that you’re presiding over a legislative session….
As a governor is reelected and serves longer and has had the opportunity to install his people or her people in state agencies through the appointments process, that’s a process that takes quite a while. At that point, I think a governor’s views shift from less of the short term to more of the long term.
Looking out beyond four years, what does Texas need to do for the next 10, 20, 50 years to remain the highly competitive, attractive state it is today?
The way that the office of governor is structured, it’s sort of a weak governorship, I suppose, baked into the Constitution. But then once you’re governor for a particular amount of time, you learn what the levers are. You learn where you can wield power.
And I’m wondering what that means for the balance of power in Texas when a governor’s been in office longer than almost anyone else in state government. Does the Legislature become less independent?
I’ve heard it said so often that it’s a weak governor in Texas. And I think that might have been the case a hundred years ago. But today, with social media, with the power of the bully pulpit, with a governor who is willing to lead, I don’t think that’s the case anymore.
So while the governor may not be the only show in town when the Legislature is around, you have to remember, the Legislature is only around for 140 days every two years… The governor is in control of implementing, and his agencies are implementing all those laws and running government by himself…
My former boss, Rick Perry, had been a House member, he had been lieutenant governor, he had run an agency at the agriculture commission, and being governor is just a whole different ball of wax than any of those things. The breadth of the office is tremendous.
And so I think there is a little bit of a learning curve. But beyond that, I think the power of the governor is very big. And I think in the right hands, a lot of good can be done.
Jorge Sanhueza-Lyon / KUT Austin
Former Gov. Rick Perry, who served from 2000-2015, currently holds the title of longest-serving Texas governor.
Is there a danger that after a decade or more in office, a governor becomes insulated from criticism? In other words, who’s left in the room who’s willing to tell him he’s wrong, especially when people come and go as they do and the governor’s still there?
I think that is a matter of how the people surrounding the governor interact with the governor and to the extent that a governor wants to have that kind of dialog.
I was very fortunate to work for a governor, Rick Perry, who enjoyed having contrarian and conflicting voices in the room with him as he made decisions. I’ve never worked for Greg Abbott, but I know that’s also how he works. He’s a very deliberative man, and that comes from his background as a lawyer and a judge.
You can imagine having a former judge as governor, he’s used to having representatives from all sides make their case and then issuing an opinion. And in this case, his opinion just happens to be the opinion that sets the policy for the state of Texas.
So I think that can be the case with a first-term governor, that could be the cases with a fourth-term governor. I think that’s just a leadership style that people either bring to the office or they don’t.
I think of Perry and Abbott as having slightly different political styles. Perry often seemed rather comfortable sharing the spotlight with other powerful Republicans. Abbott has had some very public clashes with members of his own party.
I wonder if you see the governorship as having changed perhaps, or if that has to do with personal style.
I think that may be a little bit of wearing rose-colored glasses.
Perry had his own run-ins with other elected Republicans, particularly early on in his tenure. And that was also at a time that Texas was really shifting from some Democrat control to 100% Republican control.
I think where Governor Perry benefited in the role is that he had been a member of the Legislature. So he understood intrinsically how that process worked. And then having been the head of an agency at the ag commission, he understood what it meant to be a chief executive, even if it meant just the chief executive of one agency.
I think Greg Abbott’s done a really good job of setting a message for everyone else to come in support, and he has pulled all levers of power to do that. He has used his bully pulpit.
He has pulled political levers, and I think a great example of that would be what he did to get school choice passed in the state. He was unafraid, stood 10 toes down in his convictions and was unafraid to use all the levers available to him to pass a change in policy of the state while not universally supported.
The longer someone serves as governor, does it make it more difficult for Texans to imagine someone else in that job? What do you think?
I think it goes both ways. I think there is a comfort with saying, okay, we have somebody on the ticket who is well-established and experienced, predictable. We know what we’re going to expect out of him.
That does require him, however, to make the case of, why should I have another four years? What do I need another four to accomplish that I haven’t been able to get done in 12 years? And that’s a real question voters have.
And frankly, that was a question that I posed to Gov. Perry when he decided to run for a third term.
I think it’s clear to me that Greg Abbott has also had that conversation with his staff because he spent all summer running around the state, laying out a series of policy proposals on everything from health care to education, to infrastructure, to make the case to people…
And I think if he were asked what would the number one thing he wants to do with four more years before he leaves the governorship. I believe that answer would be, I want to get control of property taxes in the state. And I expect that should he be elected, that’s going to be his laser-like focus for the next four years.
There’s been some discussion of term limits for the Texas governor which we currently don’t have. Do you see any benefit to that?
No, I’ve never been a proponent of term limits, because I think voters have a choice every four years to impose that term limit in the form of elections. He’s been on the ballot, he has made his case, and the people of Texas keep on electing him.
But when someone has been the governor for 12 or 15 years, does the advantage of incumbency make that argument less persuasive?
I think it cuts both ways. I think you have seen many times in election cycles, and I think you’re seeing it a little bit in this election cycle as well, that incumbency can be a powerful thing, but it can also be used against you.
And when you’re in an environment that we’re in right now, where the national mood is unfavorable to the president and unfavorable to the party in power… I think that will be a referendum on did Greg Abbott make the case for another four years? Are the issues that he laid out and the goals he’s setting, do Texans believe that’s worthy of another four years?
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